Steve Brown Vs Duncan Round… 4?
Mar 25th, 2008 by $eth
I’m sure if you frequent yoyo2 you’ve also see Steve Brown’s post on Yo-Yoing.com HERE.
In response to this Duncan has asked for us to post the following response:
I recently became aware that Steve Brown has been trying to drum up further controversy for Duncan on some message boards regarding Duncan’s unwillingness to sponsor events Steve Brown is “involved” in. Since the responses to the original post varied greatly, I think it’s best to just clarify Duncan’s position on this subject. Duncan will not sponsor or associate itself with any event that has Steve Brown affiliated in any official capacity such as organizing, promoting, or judging such an event. However, Duncan places no restrictions on its sponsored events with respect to Steve Brown competing or attending such events.
When Steve Brown left Duncan he obviously had a lot of bitterness in his heart for Duncan and members of our company so much so that he couldn’t contain himself. We have evidence of numerous posts on message boards and blog sites where Steve Brown wrote very derogatory remarks about Duncan and its people, often in very vulgar terms that no reasonable person would consider acceptable and worthy of continuing a relationship. Since Steve Brown’s departure from Duncan no one at Duncan has made any public statements about him to any party outside of Duncan. Despite his involvement with YoYoFactory after his departure, we were still willing to extend an amicable relationship with him. Steve Brown destroyed any goodwill he could have retained with Duncan due to these highly offensive posts. Given the level of hatred Steve Brown obviously has for Duncan we cannot expect he would maintain any objectivity toward anyone associated with Duncan in an event. So we have taken the position stated above shortly after Steve Brown made many of his statements on web boards and blog sites. This was prior to most of the 2007 contests, including World’s, Nationals, and NY International. In addition, it’s not the intent to harm or punish organizers of contests.
On a sidenote, while Steve Brown represents himself as the best thing that happened to Duncan in decades, I know from the inside that Duncan has worked on and introduced some great products in recent years and continues to be the most prominent resource for elevating awareness and participation in yo-yoing in the public eye. While Steve Brown was with Duncan he was accepted as a valued member of the team. From product development to the initiation of the Duncan Crew to contest sponsorships, he helped Duncan well. However, none of the successes Duncan had while Steve Brown was with us were solely the result of only his efforts and inputs. Had Steve Brown not been with us at that time we would have tapped inputs from other qualified people.
On a final note of clarity, while it’s true that most of our sales and profits are derived from Classic and ProYo/ProFly yo-yos, Duncan does value the members of the top players and enthusiasts in the world. They represent the leaders of yo-yo play, competitions, media coverage, and do a terrific job in overall consumer awareness.
Discuss.
Thats it! I’m deleting Duncan from my Myspace friends.
Which is on the same level as this statement, but less time consuming and not as smart sounding.
Someone please clarify the source of this “bitterness.”
It appears that the entire current situation is revolving around this “bitterness,” and no one knows anything about it apart from that it exists.
I refuse to discuss any further until I know what compelled Steve to make these “derogatory remarks” toward Duncan.
Drama.
Until people get over petty shit we will never see yoyoing like it was in 98-99. All this internet bull shit is pointless.
Shut the Fuck Up
Start Clubs
Sell yoyos
Profit
unfortunately the pettiness was at play in ‘98 just as it is now.
as an note, i am pretty sure that this was meant to be an explination to the community more than it was suppose to be a rebuttal.
sorry to hear you’re deleting duncan from your friends list, hollywood.
That was a surprisingly good response. Forgive me if I don’t take very much of that to heart, but the last paragraph was exactly what needed to be said.
-Josh
Remember Duncan is a BUSINESS.
Steve Brown is very vocal about his duncan hate, including a lot of crap about said about Jason Sauey (sp?) which was probably all true don’t get me wrong.
But as a BUSINESS, I think that they’re totally entitled and in the right here.
Steve,
I’ve read your posts about working at Duncan on your blog with some amusement. I’ve been there dude. I’ve left jobs where I felt as frustrated as you were but I’ve also learned that talking harshly about a former employer will always come back to bite you. It’s always best to just leave and not say anything. Don’t burn bridges, even if you don’t want to work there.
Now your bitching about Duncan has come back to bite you. They are wielding their economic muscle to say that frankly, they don’t want to be associated with you or around you. If I had an employee who publicly posted as vitriolic comments as you have then I would do the same. Were your employment with Duncan viewed as a metaphoric relationship then who would blame them for thinking about a restraining order?
As the largest yo-yo company in the US they have a lot of brand value with the public and deep enough pockets to be able to help our sport/past time to grow through contest sponsorships. If a contest has a choice between having you involved or money from Duncan I can understand which side they are going to choose.
Frankly you’ve put yourself into a bad situation and now you are trying to drum up more hatred for your former employer in the community that Duncan has served for more years than you’ve been around. That is petty and self-serving. The community would do best to distance themselves from a loose cannon.
My recommendation to fix things (and you will not like this)? Take down your posts, make a public apology to Duncan and post it on all the boards and then take a few years off from the boards and the contests. Focus on your store and your family. Let go of your anger.
Come back and see us in 2010 and try to learn a lesson from all this. Your words on the message boards and your blog are not going to hurt Duncan at all. All they are doing is hurting the yo-yo community and you deserve a great big kick in the for that.
For so many of us Duncan = Love. All we’ve seen from you is Steve Brown = Hate.
“I know from the inside that Duncan has worked on and introduced some great products in recent years”
So… we got the Duncan Pulse? Metal Zero? Heres a suggestion: Take the Duncan MG, make it out of high grade aluminum, get it properly anodized, replicate the sticker recess on both sides, and give it white Duncan AL caps like the original Duncan MG caps. Charge me $80-90 each and I’ll buy three.
“My recommendation to fix things (and you will not like this)? Take down your posts, make a public apology to Duncan and post it on all the boards and then take a few years off from the boards and the contests. Focus on your store and your family. Let go of your anger.”
I have barely been on the boards. I have been focusing on my family and my store. But if you think I’m going to apologize to Duncan/Flambeau for telling the truth, you are sadly mistaken.
If I get drummed out of the contest community for telling the truth…if the contest community wants Duncan’s money more than it wants my expertise, then so be it. I’m doing just fine on plenty of other fronts.
At no point have I ever assumed that anything I had to say was going to hurt Duncan’s bottom line. I have said what I’ve said because it’s the truth, and people deserve to know more than a one-sided press release issued by a company that spent 7 years looking for ways to screw me, and every other employee they have. Unless the buyers from Wal-mart and Target give a crap about the internet ramblings of an ex-employee, there is nothing I could possibly do that would ever hurt that company. But I’m sure as hell not going to hold my tongue about why I left.
Jack likes to bemoan the drama, but that didn’t stop him from telling people that I stole company info from Duncan and passed it along to Yo-Yo Factory. (Which is not only false, but it’s pretty evident that YYF doesn’t need me for anything…they’re doing just fine on their own.) Jack can decry the situation all he wants, but the truth of the matter is that he talked all his smack behind my back. At least I had the courtesy to speak my peace publicly.
As for Duncan, it’s worth noting that as soon as I took the job, the rest of the industry started taking bets on how long I would last. The longest guess was 2 years. They know what kind of people the Saueys are, and what kind of workplace they run.
A few of the more interesting reasons why I left Duncan, since people seem so curious as to why I would be furious with them:
1. I still never got paid for the Viking Tour. All the other demonstrators got paid. In fact, Duncan told me ahead of time that they would be taking a majority cut of the money that I was to be paid by the distributor as “compensation for the time I was taking off work”. (I don’t have actual number, since I deleted ALL of my Duncan files upon my exit, but it was 60% or greater.) And even after I made my peace with that lovely little bit of financial derring-do, they still never paid me.
2. I worked there for nearly 7 years without a raise. I got ONE cost of living increase during my time at the Flambeau office. One. And I made out better than most of their employees. Find me a company that treats their employees like working there is a privilege, and I’ll find you a company with a high turnover rate. Like Flambeau. In fact, they like to talk about what a pain-in-the-ass I was while working there. Yet it took them THREE YEARS to give me my first Performance Review. So obviously, I couldn’t have been that bad.
3. I was put on a bonus structure that was dependent on sales goals. At the halfway point through the year, Jason Sauey would usually change the sales goals to make sure that he didn’t have to pay out bonuses to anyone. This wasn’t just Duncan, this was every division. Ever want to have someone leave a bad taste in your mouth? Let them dangle money in front of your broke ass, and then take it away at the last second. While you’re in the middle of an expensive divorce.
4. Ever done much international travel? It’s rather exhausting. Hit three time zones on two continents that are a 23-hour flight away from your home, in a week, and then have someone tell you that you need to be in the office bright and early the next morning. I assure you, there will not be much in the way of kind, warm, fuzzy feelings. Getting any kind of comp time to defuse the effects of heavy travel on my health (which steadily declined during my time there) was like pulling teeth, and was usually met with the attitude that I was asking for special treatment. As opposed to the fact that I was sick, exhausted, and hadn’t seen my home in a month.
Ever worked somewhere that the owner of the company sent out e-mails telling everyone how they should vote in a presidential election? Ever worked somewhere that the president of the company started throwing stuff and screaming at you when you told him that his products are breaking and need to be fixed? Ever worked somewhere that quality was second-in-line to profits, but YOU had to be the guy to look a kid in the eye and sell him the product? Ever worked somewhere that the president of the company insulted your buyers at trade shows? Ever worked somewhere that they told you there was no chance for a promotion, ever, because in spite of everything you had done they simply “didn’t have the structure in place”?
I put up with all of that (and to be fair, I dealt out my fair share of abuse to the people in charge) for almost 7 years. I told my best friend about all of this, the whole way through. And as soon as I was out, he couldn’t wait to get in there.
And that’s not all of it. That’s just a highlight reel.
I owe them nothing. If anyone deserves an apology it’s every human being who works for, and has ever worked for, Flambeau and all of its divisions. All of the people who got fired because their boss was incompetent and pinned all their mistakes on the people below them. All the people who took the abuse from the owner. All the people who ever had to sit in a meeting with W.R. Sauey and listen to him making anti-Semitic comments. All the people who had to end phone calls to customers quickly because Jason was screaming so loudly that the entire office could hear it.
I didn’t even get the worst of it. Duncan’s fate doesn’t concern me one iota. Their successes and failures don’t influence my life in the slightest. I despise them, fully and completely, but ultimately they mean nothing to my life.
But I lost my best friend to a company that screwed me out of everything they could. And he went willingly, and then took up their cause, and started trying to smear me when I wasn’t around to defend myself.
So I’m supposed to look back on all of that, I’m supposed to know that even as much as I hated them I deleted all my Duncan files and never ONCE shared them with anyone…even when I was offered HARD CASH to do so…and even though I did none of the things I could have to actually hurt their business, I owe THEM an apology for freely telling the truth about why I quit?
No.
Some things are more important than being well-liked. I have no illusions that my tirades are going to affect Flambeau’s business even one tiny bit. But I’ll be damned if I’m going to shut my mouth while they drum me out of the contest community and then issue 2-page statements about how I’m the big prick for not shutting up and playing along quietly.
You want to know what Jason Sauey had to say when I tendered my resignation? He said: “I am deeply disturbed that we did not take our own positive action in this situation, and I see this is an opportunity to improve our marketing skill-sets.”
That’s how much I meant to them. “Sorry we didn’t fire you before you could quit, but don’t worry we’ll get someone better in here quickly.”
Two years later: They still haven’t hired anyone to fill my position. They still haven’t released any of the product designs I left behind. I get e-mails almost weekly from former employees who are beside themselves with glee that I’m out of the industry and free to speak the truth. And Imperials and Butterflys, which I submitted designs to improve into fully playable yo-yos during my first two years at the company, are still the #1 barrier to new players actually learning how to play.
I apologize for nothing. Dislike my methods all you want. The truth is still the truth.
Now that is yo-yo history!
If I had the choice of having steve as a judge at an event and having duncan sponsor the event, I would choose steve. He clicks freestyles like nobody’s business. Sometimes he gets 4 times the number of clicks on his clickers than any other judge, but the way the players rank based on steve’s clickers, I’m told, is always right on. Aside from that I don’t really have a comment.
Great read. I can understand why your so bitter most of the time now ;).
Lots and lots o’ love,
tyler
“I can understand why your so bitter most of the time now ;).”
That’s the thing…I’m not bitter. These are all just facts.
Duncan is no longer part of my life. My disdain for them is tremendous, but it honestly rarely comes up in my life anymore. All you guys see is the tiny part of my life that happens on message boards. The other 23 1/2 hours of my days are pretty amazing, really. And I’m really happy with everything that fills my life these days.
Flambeau/Duncan is the worst kind of corporate entity, but that doesn’t make them special. I don’t spend my days ranting about Wal-mart anymore than I spend them ranting about Duncan.
It’s just that no one on yo-yo message boards gives a shit what else is going on in my life. The people that do just call me or drop me an e-mail…the rest of ya just wait for me to get bored and post something to irritate Duncan.
Hard to be bitter when what used to be the worst part of your life is now relegated to “some people who have to pay me really tiny royalty checks 4 times a year”. I make enough money on counterweight royalties to do fun stuff for my family a few times a year. And I laugh every time I cash them.
Every time.
I can not stress enough how much Steve Brown is my Hero.
Steve Brown is my hero, and as far as I can see in the future, he won’t stop being my hero.
Honestly, I don’t think I would be yoyoing if it weren’t for Steve(/Spencer).
“Duncan does value the members of the top players and enthusiasts in the world.”
Like it or not, Steve is one of those people. So that statement is not 100% accurate.
I just don’t get why the masses are punished because Steve said some shit that they didn’t like.
Organizer: Yeah, Steve said he would volunteer some time to my contest, its kinda hard getting volunteers, but he said he would help out.
Duncan: Steve? Brown? Oh, sorry we can’t sponsor that event. I know we are easily the most recognizable brand name to the general public, but based on principal alone, we can’t. Sorry.
That may be oversimplifying, if not fictional, but it still doesn’t make sense to me.
Don’t get me wrong in the least, I LOVE me some Duncan Crew members, and in no way is this a reflection on them. I’m not really gonna delete Duncan form my Myspace… I don’t wanna do anything brash.
“Given the level of hatred Steve Brown obviously has for Duncan we cannot expect he would maintain any objectivity toward anyone associated with Duncan in an event.”
Riiiiiight.
SB said:I was put on a bonus structure that was dependent on sales goals. At the halfway point through the year, Jason Sauey would usually change the sales goals to make sure that he didn’t have to pay out bonuses to anyone.
Steve,
Sad to say this is the new business model for any sales employees that are commissions based. The companies make the commission structure so convoluted with all kinds of variables. Then change the variable every 90 to 180 days just so they don’t have to pay you commission.
Duncan really sucks! Steve you became Duncan public figure head just like I am sorry to compare you to this but “Jack” of Jack in the Box.
They used your likeness in ads, TV commercial, videos,dvd, cdv , Online video game, Freehand counter weights,Packagaing of product. So you were more to Duncan than a mere employee.That really sucks they even considered the Viking tour a vacation. You were working the whole time to promote them and make a video. If I was in your shoes I would find a lawyer who would work on a contingency basis and sue them for back wages, And being unfairly compensated for your use as a figure head. Also from preventing you from making a living in the yoyo industry. It might be worth it for you to get a free conciliation. Even if you signed away your likeness rights away when you were first employed by the company. How the hell did you know you would become a figure head for a company back then. You might have case?
steve brown made himself the face of duncan.
also, steve is in no way prohibited from making a living in the yoyo industry. less than a month after his departure from duncan he was out touring promoting another brand. that is pretty far from prohibition.
as far as i understand it, his focus just isnt the industry anymore. he performs and i would say that being a recognized face only helps in that effort.
Steve this is in no way a call out, but why even bring it up anymore?
I argue with people on the boards cause i have no life. No girlfriend, no real job, no car, and all my real friends live 20 plus minutes away. So i yoyo and bicker about petty things with people on the boards/look a digsusting viral videos/AIM.
“The other 23 1/2 hours of my days are pretty amazing, really. And I’m really happy with everything that fills my life these days.”
“Duncan is no longer part of my life.”
“I don’t spend my days ranting about Wal-mart anymore than I spend them ranting about Duncan. ”
You deffinatly have a real life, and while yes you dont post nearly as much as you did before, you still take the time to make the ocasional duncan call out. Are all these things that just need to be said? Because i have known (and alot of other players also) about the the steve brown ban for a while now but you still posted it. It just seemed a bit
You have every reason in the world to be pissed at duncan, but you claim to be past all of it.
“You deffinatly have a real life, and while yes you dont post nearly as much as you did before, you still take the time to make the ocasional duncan call out. Are all these things that just need to be said? Because i have known (and alot of other players also) about the the steve brown ban for a while now but you still posted it. It just seemed a bit unneccessary”
“You have every reason in the world to be pissed at duncan, but you claim to be past all of it. Why still post?”
Sorry, posting at 6 am after no sleep for 30 hours was not my greatist move.
Why?
The truth is the truth, and some people still don’t get it.
Plus: it amuses me greatly that Duncan honestly thinks they have to protect their bottom line by edging me out. I don’t matter. They still haven’t figured that out.
Funny, no?
Word up, very understandable.
I am officially contemplating retiring my Duncan 75th anniversary hat.
Wow…this has been an absolutely killer night time read. thats for sure.
I usually come to this site to masturbate to photos of overpriced, poorly photographed yoyos and dream of Seth’s newest haircut, but this whole thing makes me flaccid. C’mon guys, if I can’t keep hard while surfing the net, what good is it?
Spencer
PS. I am obviously kidding. To all you parents and squares who want to get offended that I talked about my penis, let me say right here that I don’t find sexual proclivity in yoyos, young boys, abusive corporate policies, or trite, soulless letters to the public. I just find penis humor vastly more entertaining than yoyo company drama and people I care about being fucked by greed.
oye? when did this happen?
i am reminded of why i dislike corporate politics. i see nothing wrong with people at the top guiding a ship they care nothing about, but there is no reason to screw over the people that help keep the ship sailing. everyone, in any position, is replaceable, but that doesn’t mean you should treat them like poo.
and seriously spencer… the pictures have gotten a lot better! but i come here for the articles anyway
Well; I made it to 57 on the 18th; which if nothing else means I have had years to think about ’stuff’. I analyze a whole lotta stuff. I study things. Break stuff down in my mind. Try to justify things to get them is the clearest perspective. It helps alot before making decisions about many things that come down the pike. Modding yoyos is a hobby of mine but studying people is way more interesting; and that is something else I do. I try to figure out what makes people,’ tick’. Dealing with people is a specialty of mine. In person I have NO Problem dealing with AnyBody……………. Anybody. All my years of data I have absorbed about ‘how people are’ has seldom failed me. In the Bodyshop Business; my knack with people has been Extremely useful in settling any disputes. Sometimes on the boards; to some; I may come off as a jerk/menace; whatever; lol. But interestingly; I am on friendly terms with just about anybody and everybody that has been around yoing in this past 10 years. So I can’t be too much of a jerk; lolol.
>>> This isn’t an advertisement for Smart pills(MO takes em and they seem to work; hahaha). The reason kinda profiled myself was to give a little more Force to what I am about to say. Steve Brown is a Friend of mine. Steve Brown is one of the most intelligent people I have ever met. Steve tells the truth regardless of whether people want to hear it. If Steve says Duncan Screwed him up and also treats their other employees poorly; then you can believe what he says. I am not saying Duncan Tortures folks. I am not saying boycott Duncan. I am not saying specific things about Duncan that may sour people on their practices. I am simply saying that I know people. And I know Steve. And Steve has no reason to bullshit anybody with misinformation about Duncan. Steve Brown is not my hero. But with a half century of thinking experience; I usually have a pretty accurate idea of ‘how things tilt’ in a reality based World.
Steve is one ka razy kinda guy but without hesitation I put more Stock it what Steve says that in Duncans Weak corporate Explanation.
I like Steve but I don’t even have to like him to believe him.
If Duncan wants to just blow it off as Steve being a disgruntled former employee; maybe they should reflect back on how he got that way; lol. Duncan not sponsoring certain contests that would use Steve in some capacity is poor judgement at it highest level.
Some say Steve should put this all behind him; etc.. Trust me; when you get messed around; you Never forget; ever. Ever. So why bother with the ‘ put it in the past’ theory?
Well; I am done beating the horse dead. But even if I beat a horse dead; I would not let Duncan kiss my Dead horses ass.
Elvis Rokks….
Mo.
Are you sure that you are only 57? You’re approaching levels of coolness that I though only a 400 year old jedi master could achieve.
wow…steve ive always taken your posting as you being bitter and annoying but after that… you made me into a believer. the sad thing is that i didnt want to believe you but your post made it really hard not to.
Pasquale
Please keep in mind that I’m not posting this in the hopes of everyone turning on Duncan. I’m posting this so that people can make their decision with all the facts.
If you can look at me, and see what I dealt with as “acceptable collateral damage” for a yo-yo company that you like, go right ahead. Jack Ringca didn’t have a problem with it. I’m sure most people won’t.
But when you support a business, you have a right to expect to know what your money is buying. So now you know.
Steve is great!
Is indifference still a sin?
From an outsiders standpoint I can see why Duncan would not want you to judge at a contest where their players are competing; if so many other players can misinterpret your feelings as bitter you could easily see why Duncan might interpret your actions as hostility towards their company, and therefore feel that you have a bias when judging their players. If I were working at Duncan and I read your comments of “Duncan is no longer part of my life” and it “rarely comes up in my life” I would hardly be convinced; if you’re initiating confrontation I’d hardly think that it’s “no longer part of your life.” You have every right to tell me I’m wrong because of this or that, but this is just what I can tell from glancing at it & sensing a lot of negative energy. You OBVIOUSLY have a lot more insight into how the company works and why they’d be doing what they’re doing (or the lack of reasoning), and have your reasons to be pissed off. Politics are politics, and these things get dirty (as everyone can see by now!)
You’re an absolutely great guy Steve, a real inspiration, and I’d hate to see you get stuck in this perpetual cycle of negative action. Taking shots at Duncan probably isn’t going to make them change their minds. Taking shots at Jack probably isn’t going to mend your friendship. I can’t tell you how to do these things, and it is in no way my position or appropriate for me to do so. I’m sure you understand 100% the spot you’re putting yourself into, but if you’re not I just hate to see you push everyone away unintentionally because you’re pissed off. Keep doing what you’re doing. Stay strong. Love.
Duncan has misconstrued my contempt for their management and business practices and extrapolated that to assume that I would be callow enough to take it out on their players.
First, with the exception of Jack, I’m still friendly with everyone on the Duncan Crew.
Secondly, I take being a judge far more seriously than these pricks give me credit for, and have NEVER allowed any personal feelings (good or bad) to influence my scoring. Ever.
And to address the rest of your point, you’ll notice that everyone is basing their judgement of my emotional involvement in all of this by my participation in threads that are…specifically discussing it.
If I was crapping up random threads with “Duncan sucks woo hoo neener neener” then yeah, I could see how people would want to take me aside and say “Dude, you really need to let go”. But the only times it comes up are when it’s specifically discussed and I chime in, or when I get an e-mail forwarded to me where Duncan is trying to make sure I’m not going to be at a contest that I never said I was going to attend.
Like I said, it’s really such a tiny, insignificant portion of my life that the idea that it’s some festering boil that is destroying me is just really, really silly.
Honestly, the entire yo-yo industry is pretty well f&*$#d. Duncan is just one more loser in the pile. There’s a reason that I didn’t leave Duncan and immediately jump into a job at another company. I’ve done exactly one piece of contract work for Yo-Yo Factory. I’ve done nothing for anyone else. I have no desire to be part of the industry anymore. I even turned down a venture capitalist who was willing to finance me if I wanted to start my own company. No way, no how. Not interested.
There are only two companies that have figured it out, and each of those has only mastered half of the puzzle. But I can say that if YYF and Anti-Yo ever joined forces (or at least paid enough attention to learn from the other what they are missing) then the industry would be a much, MUCH different place. And Duncan would have a hard time keeping up. As would everyone else.
YYFxANTIYO
I like it.
From what I have seen, both sides have made really good points.
The problem is, however, which side has made more truth.
Steve Brown HAS ranted (and justifiably so) about Duncan and it’s employees and products. However, unlike what Duncan has said, he does not do that very often. As an active member of ExtremeSpin I can truthfully say I see him once a month, maybe more or less, posting. Usually about something completely unrelated to Duncan.
The points that Duncan has made are sadly narrow-minded and time-specific. Some statements are downright false. However, the points that Steve Brown has made are not only true, they are eye-opening. For a person to be able to rile my emotions over yo-yoing is a good person. Steve may “look” unprofessional to some naive bystanders, but in reality he is one the wisest people I know. I truly try to help the yo-yo community out. But sometimes its hard. And that’s where revolutionarys like Steve come in. That’s important. He is a person. All Duncan is is a company. And all companies, no matter what the motto, are based around one thing- making money. Steve Brown couldn’t care less if his comments made him money or not. And that’s a good person indeed.
My choice goes to Steve Brown.
-gregleo
what do you think is “downright false”? curious.
to call steve brown a revolutionary is a gross overstatement and only colours any flag waving you might do for him. he has done things good and bad. we all have. that doesn’t make anything an exclusive “choice” to be made.
moreover, with a business of his own and a family to take care of, i am sure steve has to care at least a little about weather or not his viewpoints make him money.
One thing that I interpreted as “downright false” would be that Steve claims to be the best thing that has happend to Duncan in decades. I have never heard him say this. If I am wrong in my assumptions, please correct me Jack.
However, I somewhat agree with your second paragraph and I will admit to perhaps overstating his good side. We have all done good and bad things, and I am sure none of us are an exception.
I have nothing against you personally, Jack Ringca. I have discussed things with you over the Duncan forums and I hold a lot of respect for you and I hope the viewpoint is mutual. You are an incredible yo-yoer and a good man. You were one of the many people that I watched over the Duncan CD’s and admired.
But the person that I noticed most was Steve Brown. He has a way of noticing things, getting things done, and speaking his mind, whether or not it makes him any more or less likeable. And most of the time, he is right. That was where my previous post had its heart.
I have nothing against the members of Duncan, including Jack Ringca. They are all fun people and I would like to get to know them all. But I do have an issue when I hear something like this. I would like to know more however, before I bias myself completely towards one side or another. As I said before, though, the plethera of my votes go to Steve.
i appreciate your level head. you have mail.
Thank you so much. I understand more fully the situation now. The mail has been replied to.
haha
drama
Ps: why did you stay so long if you hated it?
Snergle: I thought I could make a difference. As evidenced by Duncan’s current stance on things, and Jack Ringca’s dismissal of our friendship for a few bucks, I was evidently very, very wrong.
last i checked, you were the one who cut it off. i never dismissed anything.
nice try.
Keep telling yourself that.
…Jack, nothing you have said in this thread helps your position at all. It only reinforces Steve’s argument.
wow i never knew how fucked up the professional yo-yo industry is! whatever happend to just the love of the yo-yo and the contest to see who is the best of the best? i guess when money comes in it really ruins everything.
Here is the evidence Steve could not display ‘objectivity toward anyone associated with Duncan ‘ !!!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320238880928
BIG+ASS+COCKS…
BIG+ASS+COCKS…